Ontario. Legislative Assembly.

Correspondence, papers and documents, of dates from 1856 to 1882 inclusive, relating to the northerly and westerly boundaries of the province of Ontario online

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Online LibraryOntario. Legislative AssemblyCorrespondence, papers and documents, of dates from 1856 to 1882 inclusive, relating to the northerly and westerly boundaries of the province of Ontario → online text (page 38 of 86)
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boundary proposed).

H. — Extract — Bouchette's History of Canada, describing boundaries (1832).

I. — Extract — Opinion of Judges on boundary, from De Beinhardt's trial

K. — Extract — Commission to Guy Carleton, 1786.

L. — Extract — King's Proclamation, 1763.



Heport op a Committbb of THE Privy Council, approved by the Governor-General

ON THE 28th November, 1871. t

On a memorandum dated 25th November, 1871, from the Hon. the Secretary of
Btate, submitting that applications have been made to him for mining licenses and
patents for land in the neighbourhood of Lake Shebandowan, and in places about the
head of Lake Superior, and recommending that, pending the locating of the boundary
line between the North-West Territory and the Province of Ontario, no action be taken
upon these or any similar applications ; and further recommending that the Lieutenant-
Governor of Ontario be informed of the course' proposed to be taken by your Excellency's
Government, and that it be suggested that the Government of that Province should, in
like manner, refrain from granting patents or mining licenses in the region of country
iibout the head of Lake Superior and Lake Shebandowan until after the boundary line

*rMr. Bouchette'i opinion is not wholly in f avonr of Colonel Dennis's yiew. For example, he oopiee
:from General Clarke's Proclamation, without objection or comment, the words following : '* from the head
■ofthe said lake (Temiscamingue) by a line drawn due north until it strikes the boundiuy line of Hudson's
Bay ; including all the country to uie westward and southward of the said line to the utmost extent of th«
•country commonly called or known by the name of Canada." (See his Topographical Description, London,
1816, quoted in Book Arb. Docs., p. 390.) Again, speaking of tipper Canada, tne same author says : — " On
the west and north no limits have been assigned to it ; therefore it may be supposed to extend over the ya^t
Mgions ^at spread towards the Pacific and the Northern Oceans." (Quoted at p. 391 of Arb. Docs.) Onh it
nap of Tipper Canada, 1815, he shows the Province as extending beyond the height of land both on the
norai and to the west — on the west as far at least as the north-west point of the Lake of the Woods. — C-. E. L. l

t Sees. Papers, Ont., 1873, No. 44, p. 6.



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214 QU£SnOK OF QBANTIHO PATENTS FOR LANDS AT HEAD OF LAKE SX7PERI0R.



shftll have been so located ; and farther submitting that it is of much consequence that
the ascertaining and fixing on the ground of the boundary line in question should be as
&r as possible expedited :

The Committee concur in the above recommendations and submit the same for year
Excellency's approval

Certified.

Wm. H. Lbe,

Clerk, P.O.
The Hon. Secretary of State for Canada.



The Sbcretaiit of State to the LiEnTENANT-GoYERNOR.*

Department of the Secretary of State for the Provinces,

Ottawa, 30th November, 187L

Sir, — I have the honour to transmit to you herewith a copy of an Order of His
Excellency the Governor-General in Council, on the subject of the granting mining
licenses and patents for lands in the neighbourhood of Lake Shebandowan and in places
about the head of Lake Superior.

May I request that you will have the goodness to bring the matter under the early
notice of your Government, and communicate to me their views thereon for the informar
tion of His Excellency the Governor-General in CounciL

I have the honour to be. Sir,

Your most obedient servant,

J. HowB,
Secretary of State for the Provinces.
Hon W. P. Howland, C.B.,

Lieutenant-€k>vemor, Toronto.



Minute of Council, approved by the Lieutenant-Governor, on the 4th

January, 1872.t

The Committee of Council have had under consideration the communication of the*
Honourable the Secretary of State for the Provinces, dated 30th November, 1871, trana-
mitting a copy of a report of the Committee of the Privy Council of Canada, approved by
His Excellency the (Jovemor-General in Council on the 28th November, 1871, wherein it
is recommended that, pending the locating of the boundary line between the North- West
Territory and the Province of Ontario, no action should be taken upon applications for
mining licenses and patents for land in the neighbourhood of Lake Shebandowan and in
places about the head of Lake Superior by the Dominion Government, and suggesting
that the Government of Ontario ^ould in like manner refrain from granting patents or
mining licenses in the said region until after the boundary line aforesaid should have been
*eBtablis|ied.

The Committee advise that the Secretary of State be informed that the said com-
munication and enclosure have been referred to the Honourable the Conunissioner of
Crown Lands and that immediately upon his reporting in respect thereof the matter will
be taken into consideration by your Excellency ; and further that concurring in the state-
ment contained in the said report of Council tluit it is of so much consequence that the-
ascertaining and fixing on the ground of the boundary line in question should be as to as>

* Seas. Papers, Ont, 1873, No. 44, p. 5. t Und, p. 6.

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OOBRESPONDENCE RESPBCrriNG INSTBUCTIONS TO DOM. COMMISSIONER, 1872. 216



poeaible expedited, your Excellency is desirous that the draft instructioiis proposed to bo
given to the Commissioner should be at the earliest possible moment submitted for the
oonsideration of your Excellency.

Certified.



4th January, 1872.



J. G. Scott,

C. E, C.



The Lieutenakt-Goyerkor to the Secretart op State.*

GOYERNMBNT HoUSB,

Toronto, 6th January, 1872.

Sir, — With reference to your despatch dated 30th November, covering a copy of a
report of a Committee of the Privy Council making certain recommendations as to the
issue of patents in the neighbourhood of Lake Shebandowan, and urging the early settle-
ment of the boundary question, I now have the honour to inform you that the subject
has been referred to Uie consideration of the Commissioner of Crown Lands in this Prov-
inoe, and that as soon as his report upon it can be obtained the Executive Council will
oome to a decision in the matter. In the meantime, I concur in the view expressed in
the Minute of the Privy Council, that the boundary line in question should be ascertained
and fixed with all possible speed, and, to prevent unnecessary delay, would suggest that
a draft of the instructions proposed to be given by the Government of the Dominion to
the Commissioner appointed, be transmitted for the consideration of the Government of
this Province at the earliest moment.

I have the honour to be. Sir,

Your obedient servant,

W. P. HOWLAND.

The Hon. the Secretary of State for the Provinces,
Ottawa.



The Secretary of State to the Lieutenant-Governor.*

Department of the Secretary of State for the Provinces,

Ottawa, 11th January, 1872.

Sir,- -I have the honour to acknowledge the receipt of your despatch of the 6th
instant, in reply to mine of the 30th November last, in reference to the locating of the
bounduy line between the North- West Territory and the Province of Ontario, near the
head of Lake Superior, and suggesting that a draft of the instructions given by the
Dominion (Government to the Commissioner appointed oh its behalf, be forwarded to
your Government.

I have the honour to be. Sir,

Your obedient servant,

Joseph Howe.
Hon. W. P. Howland, C.B.,

Lieutenant-Governor, Toronto.

*Ses8. Papers, Ont., 1873, No. 44, p. 7.

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216 ACTION OF ONTARIO BOUNDARY COMMISSIONER, 1872.



Thb Acting Assistant Pbovinoial Sbcbbtabt to Mb. McDougall.*

Pbotikclal Sbobbtabt's Office,

ToBONTO, March 5th, 1873.

Sib, — ^Adverting to the communication from this Department, under date 20th
September llEist, informing you that His Excellency the Lieutenant-Goyemor had been
pleased to appoint you Commissioner on behalf of this Province, in the matter of the
settlement of the boundary line between Ontario and the North-West Territories, I have
now i^e honour, in pursuance of a conversation that took place some time ago between
the President of the Council and yourself, to request you to forward, at your earliest con-
venience, a detailed report upon the whole subject of the North- West boundary, also a
report stating your action under the Commission, with the result of any conference you
may have had with the Dominion authorities. You will also be good enough to state, for
the information of His Excellency the Lieutenant-Governor, your views of the probable
action of the Commissioner appointed on behalf of the Dominion, and to offer any sug-
gestions you may consider it desirable to make as to the conduct and probable results of
the Commission.

I have the honour to be. Sir,

Your obedient servant,

I. R ECKABT,

Acting AsHstant Secretary.
Hon. W. McDougall, C.B.,
Toronto.



Mb. MgDouoall to thh Pbovinoial SBCBBTABT.f

March 9th« 1872.

Sib, — I have the honour to acknowledge your communication of the 5th inst., in
which you refer to a conversation between Uie Honourable the President of the Council
and myself on the subject of the " North-West" Boundary, and (1) request me in pur-
suance of that conversation to forward a detailed report upon the whole subject, and (2)
also to report my action under the Commission of the 20th of September, with tiie result
of any conference I may have had with ihe Dominion authorities. I observe that you
further request me (3) to state, for the information of His Excellency, my views of the
probable action of the Commissioners appointed on behalf of the Dominion, and (4) to offer
^^7 suggestions I may think desirable as to the conduct and probable result of the
Commission.

I have the honour to state in reply that I have not yet received any instructions
from His Excellency as to the time, place, or manner in which I should proceed to execute
the commission entrusted to me.

The letter of appointment merely informed me that the object of the Commission was
" the settlement of the boundary between Ontario and the North-West Territories," and
that Eugene E. Tach6, Esq., had been appointed on behalf of the Dominion, and that His
Excellency had named me to act in conjunction with him.

The Lftte Attorney-General, Hon. J. S. Macdonald, on one or two occasions expressed
to me verbally his opinion as to the scope of the inquiry and the nature and effect of the
report which the Commissionnrs were expected to make, but gave no official directions in
the matter.

I have not yet been put in communication with the Commissioner appointed on
behalf of the Dominion, and am therefore unable to report anything as to Ids views.

But having twice visited Ottawa in the hope of meeting him, and having conferred

*Ses8.PApwB,0^t,1873,No. 44,p.7. fiMd., p.8;

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ACTION OP ONTABIO BOUNDARY COMMISSIONER, 1872. 217



with certain members and officers of the Dominion Government on the subject of the
Oommission, I have formed an opinion as to the nature of the instructions prepared for
him, which I beg to submit in the form of a confidential memorandum. I also beg to
refer to tiiis memorandum for any further information under the second and third heads
mentioned in your letter.

I have collected the greater part of the materials for a report which I expected to
make in conjunction with the Commissioner for the Dominion, on that part of the boun-
dary between the Province of Ontario and the Territories of Uie Dominion which crosses
the line of communication between Lake Superior and the new Province of Manitoba, but
I regret that certain maps ordered from England, and which, in my judgment will be very
important in the event of a serious difference of opinion between the Commissioners or
the respective Governments as to this part of the boundary, have not yet reached me.

I presume that the detailed report upon the whole subject of the North-West boun-
dary which you have asked me to forward, is not the final report under my commission,
bat a preliminary statement for the information of His Excellency of the present position
of the question, and the opinions I have formed from such documents, maps, and proofs as
are accessible to me, of the actual location of the north-western boundary of Ontario, or
as to the manner in which it must be determined.

I shall have the honour in two or three days to submit a report of the character
referred to in my conversation with the President of the Council, in the form of a pre-
liminary memorandum, which I trust will meet the approval of His Excellency.

The 4th and last point mentioned in your letter, viz., an invitation to offer any sug-
gestions I may think desirable '* as to the conduct and probable results of the Commission''
may be conveniently disposed of in this communication.

Having reason to believe, as will appear in the confidential memorandum herewith,
that the Commissioner for the Dominion will take the ground that a line due north from
the junction of the '*Ohio" with the " Mississippi " is the legal western boundary of
Ontario, or that the height of land west and north of Lake Superior is the utmost
western limit of the Province ; and being of opinion myself that the limit is much further
west, I do not think we shall be able to agree upon a joint report, or that the respective
Oovemments will adopt, without protracted and perhaps angry discussions, the view of
either party ; I have therefore suggested in a friendly and unofficial way to members of
the Dominion €k>vemment, as well as to the late Attorney-General of Ontario, the ex-
pediency of appointing, before the Commissioners begin their discussion, a third person of
abOity and position, unconnected with Canada, to act as umpire in case of dispute, and the
giving to the report of the Commission thus constituted the character of an atoorcf, subject,
of course, to the final approval of Parliament

So far as I could judge, both Sir J. A. Macdonald and Sir George Cartier, to whom
I made the suggestions, viewed it fevourably.

I respectfuUy recommend, in answer to the invitation in your letter, the expediency
of a proposition by His Excellency the Lieutenant-Governor of Ontario to the Govemor-
Oeneral for the reconstruction of the boundary Commission in the manner suggested. I
need not point out the serious inconvenience and embarrassments which would probably
follow a disagreement between the Commissioners, concurred in by the respective Gk>vem-
ment& Experience teaches but one lesson in these cases, viz., that it is easier and safer
to agree upon a reference than upon the details of a settlement, and that two referees are
quite as likely to disagree as the original contestants.

I have the honour to be, Sir,

Your obedient servant,

Wm. MoDouoall.
The Honourable the Provincial Secretary,
Toronto.



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218 INSTRUCTIONS TO THE DOMINION BOUNDARY COMMISSIONER, 1872.



RbpOBT OF THB MiNISTBB OF JUSTIOB.*

Ottawa, 11th March, 1872.

' Beference having been made to the undersigned of the Order in Council, of the
28th November last, on the subject of applications for mining locations, and patents for
land in the neighbourhood of Lake Shebiuidowan, and about the head of Lake Superior,
and also of the despatch of the Lieutenant-Governor of Ontario on such Order in Council,
he begs leave to report : —

dniat the Lieutenant-Governor, in his despatch of the 6th January, states as^
follows : — " In the meantime I concur in the view expressed in the Minute of the Privy
Council, that the boundary line in question should be ascertained and ^xed with all
possible speed, and to prevent unnecessary delay would suggest that a draft of the in-
structions proposed to be given by the Government of the Dominion to the Combiissioner
appointed, be transmitted for the consideration of the Government of this Province at
the earliest moment.*'

The undersigned with the view, therefore, of meeting the desire expressed by the
Lieutenant-Governor, and after consultation with Surveyor-General Dennis,! begs leave
to recommend that a copy of the draft instructions, hereunto annexed, be transmitted to
the Government of Ontario.

All of which is respectfully submitted.

John A. Magdonald.



InSTBUOTIONS to THB COMMISSIONBB FOB THB DOMINION. J!

Dbaft of Instructions to be given to the Commissioner appointed to act on behalf of the
Dominion of Canada in the survey and location of the boundary line between the
North- West Territories and the Province of Ontario, in conjunction with a Commis-
sioner, to be appointed by the Government of Ontario.

The boundary in question is clearly identical with the limits of the Province of
Quebec, according to the 14th Geo. III., cap. 83, known as the "Quebec Act," and is
described in the said Act as follows, that is to say : EEaving set forth the westerly
portion of the southern boundary of the Province as extending along the River Ohio
** westward to the hanks of the Mississippi^^' the description continues from thence (i.0., the
junction of the two rivers) ** owrf northtoard to the southern boundary of the territcrf
granted to the Merchants Adventv/rers of England trading to Hvdson's Bay" .

Having determined the precise longitude west of Greenwich of the extreme point
of land marking the junction of the north and east banks respectively of the said
rivers, you will proceed to ascertain and define the corresponding point of longitude of
the intersection of the meridian passing through the said junction with the international
boundary between Canada and the United States.

Looking, however, at the tracing enclosed, marked A, intended to illustrate these
instructions, it is evident such meridian would intersect the international boundary in
Lake Superior.

Presuming this to be the case, you will determine and locate the said meridian, the
same being the westerly portion of the boundary in question, at such a point on the
northerly shore of the said lake as may be nearest to the said international boundary, and
from thence survey a line due south to deep water, marking the same upon and acrow
any and all points or islands which may intervene ; and from the point on the main shore,
found as aforesaid, draw and mark a line due north to the southern boundary of the
Hudson's Bay Territory before mentioned.

* House of CommoiiH Return of 19th March, 1881, No. 37, p. 4.

t [See the Report of Mr. DenniB on the Boundaries, Ist Ootober, 1871, ante, p. 209.— G. E. L.]

t Sees. Papers, Ont., 1873^ No. 44, p. 15.



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INSTRUCTIONS TO THE DOBHNION BOUNDARY COMMISSIONER, 1872. 219*



This will complete the survey of the westerly boundary line sought to be estab-
lished.

You will then proceed to trace out^ surrey and mark, eastwardly, the aforemen-
tioned ^^BotUhem boundary qf the ierritory granted to the Merchants Adventurers of
England trading to Hudson's Bay,**

This is well understood to be the height of land dividing the waters which flow into
Hudson's Bay from those emptying into the valley of the great lakes, and forming:
the northern boundary of Ontario ; and the same is to be traced and surveyed, following:
its various windings till you arrive at the angle therein between the Provinces of
Ontario and Quebec, as the latter is at present bounded ; having accomplished which,
the service will have been completed.

Your requisition for such assistance, scientific and otherwise, as may be necessary to
enable you to determine the necessary longitude with precision, and to effect the practical
surveying operations in the field and for such instruments as may be required will
receive due consideration.

Further instructions relating to the character of the boundary marks to be erected,,
and conveying other information which you will probably require will be duly sent
you.



Rbport of a Oommittbe of thb Pbivt Council, appbovbd bt the Govbbnob*
Gbnbbal ok thb 12th March, 1872.*

The Committee have had before them a memorandum, dated 11th March, 1872,
from the Honourable the Minister of Justice, stating that reference having been made
to him of the Order in Council of the 28th November last, on the subject of applications
for mining locations and patents for land in the neighbourhood of lake Shebandowan,
and about the head of Lake Superior, and also of the despatch of the lieutenant-
Qovemor of Ontario on such Order in Council ; he reports.

That the lieutenant-Qovemor in his despatch of the 6th of January, states as
follows : — '* In the meantime I concur in the views expressed in the Minute of the
Privy Council that the boundary line in question should be ascertained and fixed with
all possible speed, and to prevent unnecessary delay, would suggest that a draft of the
mstructions proposed to be given by the Oovemment of the Dominion to the Commissioner
appointed be transmitted f6r the consideration of the Government of this Province at
iAe earliest moment."

That with the view, therefore, of meeting the desire expressed by the Lieutenant-
Governor, and after consultation with Surveyor-General Dennis, he, the Minister of
Justice, recommends that a copy of the draft instructions annexed to lus memorandum
be transmitted to the Government of Ontario.

The Committee submit the above recommendations for your Excellency's
approvaL

Certified.

Wm. n. Lbb,

Clerk F.C.



Thb SbCBBTARY of StATB to thb LlBUTBNANT-G0VBBN0R.t

Dbpabtubnt of thb Sbcrbtabt of Statb fob THB Provincbs,

Ottawa, Uth March, 1872.

Sib, — With reference to your despatch. No. 138, of the 6th January last, I have
the honour, in compliance with the request therein contained, to transmit to you here-



* House of Commons Return, Much 19, 1881, No. 37, p. 6.
fSess. VvpevB, Ont.,1873, No. 44, p. 14.

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220 COBBESPONDENCE RESPECTING INSTBUCTIONS TO BOM. COlOOSSIONEBy 1872.



wiih a copy of the instructions to be given to the Commissioner appointed to act oa
behalf of the Dominion of Canada in the survej and location of the boundarj line between
the North- West Territories and the Province of Ontario.

I have the honour to be, Sir,

Your obedient servant,

Joseph Howb,
Secretary of State for the Provineee,
Hon. W. P. Howland, C.R,

lieutenant-Govemor, Toronto.



The Seobetabt of State to the Lieutenant-Oovbbmob. *

Department of the Secbbtaby of State fob the Pbovinobs,

Ottawa, 15th March, 1872.

Sib, — With reference to mj letter of the 14th instant, I have the honour to transmit
herewith a tracing which, it is requested, may be substituted for that which accompanied
the draft of instructions to be given to the Commissioner appointed by the Dominion in
the survey and location of the boundary line between the North- West Territories and
the Province of Canada, a copy of which was enclosed in my letter above referred to.

May I request that you will have the goodness to cause the tracing for which th«
enclosed is substituted to be returned to this Department.

I have the honour to be. Sir,

Your obedient servant,

Joseph Hows,
Secretary of State for the Provinces,
Hon. W. P. Howland, C.B.,

Lieutenant-Govemor, Toronto.

\Memor€mdwm,'^Qoyj of a tracing, showing boundary line between Dominion and
Province of Ontario.]



The Lieutenant-Govbbnob to the Seobbtaet of State.!

oovebkment housb,

ToBONTO, 19th March, 1872.

Sib, — I have the honour to acknowledge the receipt of your despatches of Hth
and 15th instant, enclosing tracings with reference to the boundary line between thii
Province and the North- West Territories, and to return herewith, as requested, th«
tracing enclosed in your former despatch.

I have the honour to be, Sir,

Your obedient servant,

W. P. HOWLAVD.

Hon. Secretary of State (Provinces), Ottawa.

*Ses8. Papers, Ont, 1873, No. 44, p. 15. \ Ibid,, p. 16.

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MEMO. OF THE ONT. COMMISSIONER RESPECTING WESTERN BOUNDARY, 1872. 221



Thb Acting Assistant Provincial Secretary to Mr. MoDouqall.*

Provincial Secretary's Office,

Toronto, 19th March, 1872.

Sib, — ^I am oommanded to request that joa will, at the earliest possible moment^
sabmit to the Government the further report promised bj jour last communication. It
is eztremelj important that the Government should receive this report as soon as possible.

I have the honour to be. Sir,

Your obedient servant, ,

I. R ECKHART,

Aoting AssisknU Secretary,
Hon. William McDougall, C.B.,
etc., etc, eta, Toronto.



Memorandum of Mr. McDougall. f

PuLiMiNARY Memorandum, for the information of the Lieutenant-Governor of Ontario^



Online LibraryOntario. Legislative AssemblyCorrespondence, papers and documents, of dates from 1856 to 1882 inclusive, relating to the northerly and westerly boundaries of the province of Ontario → online text (page 38 of 86)