Moral and political dialogues : with letters on chivalry and romance (Volume 1) online

m










N THE CUSTODY OT ThE

BOSTON PUBLIC LIBRARY.



SHELF N






MORAL AND POLITICAL
DIALOGUES;

WITH

LETTERS ON
CHIVALRY AND ROMANCE:

B Y THE

REVEREND MR. HURD,

IN THREE VOLUMES.

THE THIRD EDITION.

VOL, I.



LONDON,

PRINTED BY W BOWYER,

FORA. MILLAR, INTHE STRAND; AND

W. THURLBOURN AND J. WOODYER,

AT CAMBRIDGE. MDCCLXV.



RED



TO THE MEMORY OF THE LATE

RALPH ALLEN ES



O F



PRIOR-PARK.




SI NOBIS ANIMVM EONI VIRI LICERET INSPICERE, O
QVAM PVLCRAM FACIEM, QVAM SANCTAM, qVAM
EX MAGNIFICO PLACIDOQVE FVLGENTEM VIDERE- .
MVS ! NEMO ILLVM AMABILEM, QVI NON SIMV
VENERAEILEM, DICERET. SENECA.



'CONTENTS.

V O L. I.

PREFACE on the manner of writing Dialogue.

DIALOGUE I.

On infmcerity In the commerce of the world.

DR.. MORE, MR. WALLER.
DIALOGUE II.

On retirement.

MR. COWLEY, DR. SPRAT.
DIALOGUE III.

On the age of ^ELIZABETH.

MR. DIGBY, DR. ARBUTHNOT, MR. ADDISON.

VOL. II.

DIALOGUE IV.

On the age of ^ELIZABETH.

MR. DIGBY, DR. ARBUTHNOT, MR. ADDISOX.
DIALOGUES V, VI.

On the conflltutlon of the Englifh government.

SIR J. MAYNARD, MR. SOMERS, BP. BURNET.

VOL,



CONTENTS.
VOL. III.

DIALOGUES VII, VIII.
On the ufes of foreign travel.

LORD SHAFTESBURY, MR. LOCKE.
XII LETTERS ON

Chivalry and Romance.



PREFACE,



MORAL



AND



POLITICAL



DIALOGUES,



Vo L. I.



DI A-



C i 3



PREFACE

ON T H t

MANNER OF WRITINGDIALOGUE;

- **

THE former editions of thefe
Dialogues were given with-
out a name, and under the fictitious
perfon of an Editor : Not, the rea-
der may be fare, for any purpofe fo
filly as that of irnpofing on the
Public $ but for reafons of another
kind, which it is not difficult to
apprehend.

HOWEVER thefe reafons* what-
ever they were, fubfifting no longer,
the writer is now to appear in his
. L * own



il PREFACE,

own perfon ; and the refpedl, he
owes to the public, makes him
think it fit to befpeak their accept-
ance of thefe volumes in another
manner, than he fuppofed would be
readily permitted to him, under his
affumed character.

I. IN an age, like this, when moft
men feem ambitious of turning
Writers, many perfons may think
it ftrange that the kind of com-
pofition, which was chiefly in ule
among the mafters of this numer-
ous and ftirring family, hath been
hitherto neglected.

WHEN the ANTIENTS had any
thing

" BUT what, it will be faid, al-
" ways the Antients ? And are we

*< never



PREFACE, iii

csr never to take a pen in hand, but
" the firft queftion muft ftill be,
" what our mafters, the antients,
" have been pkafed to didtate to
f us ? ONE man understands, that
" the antient Ode was diftinguifh-
t ed into feveral parts, called by I
" know not what ftrange names;
" and then truly an Englifh Ode
" muft be tricked out in the fame
" fantaftic manner. ANOTHER has
" beared of a wife, yet merry, com-
" pany called a Chorus, which was
" always finging or preaching in
* f the Greek Tragedies ; and then,
** befure, nothing will ferve but we
S muft be fung and preached to,
*' in our's. While a THIRD^ is
** fmitten with a tedious long-wind-
** ed thing, which was once en-
** dured under the name of Dia-

a a u logue;



Iv P K E F A C E.

" logue ; and ftrait we have
* r logues of this formal cut, and are
** told withal], that no man may
" prefume to write them, on any
" other model/ 1

THUS the modern critic, with
much complacency and even gaye-
ty But I refume the fentence I fet
out with, and obferve, " WHEN
THE AMTIENTS had any thing
to fay to the world on the fub-
je<ft either of morals or govern-
ment, they generally chofe the
way of DIALOGUE,, for the con-
veyance of their inftrudlions ; as
fuppofing- they might chance to
gain a readier acceptance in this
agreeable form, than any other."

Hsec adeo penitus cura videre fagaci

Otia qui fludiis la&ti tenuere' decoris,

Inaue



PREFACE. <?

Inque Ac AD EMI A umbrifera hiudoque

LYCEO
Fuderunt claras foecundi peftoris artes.



SUCH was the addrefs, or fancy
at Jeaft, of the wife ANTIENTS.

THE MODERNS, on the contrary,
have appeared to reverence them-
felves or their caufe, too much, to
think that either flood in ileed of
this oblique management. No
writer has the leaft doubt of be-
ing favourably received in all com-
panies, let him come upon us in
what ihape he will : And, not to
ftand upon ceremony, when he
brings fo welcome a prefent, as
what he calls Truth, with him, he
obtrudes it upon us in the direct
way of Diflertation.



No



E P R E F A C E.

^f

No body, I fuppofe, objects to
this practice, when important truths
indeed are to be taught, and when
the abilities of the Teacher are
fuch as may command refpedr. But
the cafe is different, when writers
prefume to try their hands upon us,
without thefe advantages. Nay,
and ,:syen with them, it can do no
hurt, when the fubjeft is proper
for familiar difcourfe, to throw it
into this gracious and popular form.

I HAVE faid, 'where the Jubjeft is.
proper for familiar difcourfe ; for all
fubjedts, I think, cannot, or fhould
not, be treated in this way.

IT is true, the inquifitive genius
of the Academic Philofophy gave

great



PREFACE. VH

great fcope to the freedom of de-
bate. Hence the origin of the
Greek Dialogue : of which if
PLATO was not the Inventor, he
was, at lead, the Mode},

THIS fceptical humour was pre-
fently much increafed ; and every
thing was now difputed, not for
PLATO'S reafon (which was, alfo,
his matter's) for the fake of ex-
pofing Falfhood and difcovering
^fruth ; but, becaufe it was pre-
tended that nothing could be cer~
tainly affirmed to be either true or



And, when afterwards CICERO,
our other great mailer of Dialogue,
introduced this fort of writing into
Rome, we know that, befides his

a 4 profeffion



vlii PREFACE.

profefllon of the Academic Sefl:,
now extended and indeed outraged
into abfolute fcepticifm, the very
purpofe he had in philofophizing,
and the rhetorical ufes to which he
put his Philofophy, would deter-
mine him very naturally to the fame
practice.

THUS all fubjecls, of what na-
ture and importance foever, were
equally difcuffed in the antient Dia-
logue ; till matters were at length
brought to that pafs, that the only
end, propofed by it, was to {hew
the writer's dexterity in difputing
for, or againft any opinion, without
referring his difputation to any cer-
tain ub or conclufion at all.

SUCH



PREFACE. be

SUCH was the character of the
antient, and efpecially of the Cice-
ronian Dialogue ; arifing out of the
genius and principles of thofe times.

BUT for us to follow our mailers
in this licence would be, indeed, to
defer ve the obje&ed charge of fer-
tile Imitators ; fince the rpafons,
that led them into it, do not fubfift
in our cafe. They difputed every
thing, becaufe they believed no-
thing. We fhould forbear to di-
pute fome things, becaufe they are
fuch as, both for their facrednefs,
and certainty, no man in his fenfes
affedls to dilbelieve. At leaft, the
ftoic BALE us may teach us a de-
cent referve in one inftance, Since,
as he obferves, it is a wicked and



IfflfWUS



PREFACE



impious cuftom to difpute againft the

Being, Attributes, and Providence

of God, whether it be under an af-*

fumed char after, or in ones own



THUS much I have thought fit
to fay, to prevent rniftakes, and to
fhew of what kind the fubjedts are
which may be allowed to enter into
modern Dialogue. They are only
fuch, as are either, in the ftrid;
fenfe of the word, not important,
and yet afford an ingenuous pleafure
in the difcuffion of them ; or noty3
important as to exclude the fcepti-
cal inconclufive air, which the de-
corum of polite dialogue neceffarily
demands.



Mala et impia confuetudo eft contra
Deos difputancli, five ex animo id fit, five
fimulate. De Nat. D, 1. ii. c. 67.

AND,



P R E F A C E.



AND, under tliefe reftrifiions, we
may treat a number of curious and
ufeful fubjects, in this form. The
benefit will be that which the an-
tients certainly found in this prac-
tice, and which the great mafter of
life finds in the general way of
candour and politenefs,

-parcentis viribus, atque
Extenuantis eas confulto

i

FOR, though Truth be not for-
mally delivered in Dialogue, it may
be infinuated ; and a capable writer
will find means to do this fo ef-
fectually as, in difcuffing both fides
of a queftion, to engage the reader
infenfibly on that fide, where the
Truth lies.

II. BUT



PREFACE.



II. BUT convenience is not the
only confider ation . The NOVELTY
of the thing, itfelf, may well re-
commend it to us.

*

FOR, when every other /pecies
of compofition has been tried, and
men are grown fo faftidious as to
receive with indifference the beft
modern productions, on account of
the too common form, into which
they are caft, it may feem an at-
tempt of fome merit to revive the
only one, almoft, of the antient
models, which hath not yet been
made cheap by vulgar imitation.

I CAN imagine the reader will
conceive fome furprize, and, if he
be no): a candid one, will perhaps

exprefs



P R E F A C E,

exprefs fome difdain, at this pre-
tence to Novelty, in cultivating the
Dialogue-form* For what, he will
fay, has been more frequently aim-
ed at in our own, and every modem
language ? Has not every art, nay,
every fcience, been taught in this
way ? And, if the vulgar ufe of any
mode of writing be enough to dif-
credit it, can there be room even
for wit and genius to retrieve the
honour of this trite and hackneyed

*

form ?

-
THIS, no doubt, may be faidj

but by thofe who know little of the
antient Dialogue, or who have not
attended to the true manner in
which the rules of good writing re-
quire it to be compofed,

WE



xir PREFACE,

WE have what are called Dia*
logues in abundance ; and the au-
thors, for any thing I know, might
pleafe themfelves with imagining,
they had copied PLATO or CICERO.
But in our language, at leaft (and*
if I extended the obfervation to the
other modern ones of mofl eftima-
tion, I fhould perhaps do them no
wrong) I know of nothing in
the way of Dialogue that deferves
to be confidered by us with fuch
regard.

THERE are in Englifh THREE
Dialogues, and but Three, that are
fit to be mentioned on this occa
fion : all of them excellently well
compofed in their way, and, it muft
be owned, by the very beft and

politeft



PREFACE. xr

politeft of our writers. And had
that way been the true one, I mean
that which antiquity and good cri^
ticifm recommend to us, the public
had never been troubled with this
attempt from me, to introduce an-
other.

THE Dialogues I mean are, The
Moralifts of Lord SHAFTESBURYJ
Mr. ADDISON'S Treatife on Me*
dais j and the Minute Philofopher of
Bi/hop BERKELY : And, where is
the modefly, it will be faid, to at-*
tempt the Dialogue-form, if it has
not fucceeded in fuch hands ?

THE anfwer is fliort^ and, I hope,
not arrogant. Thefe applauded
perfons fuffered themfelves to be
mifled by modern practice; and*

with



xvi PREFACE.

with every ability to excel in this
nice and difficult compofition, have
written beneath themfelves, only
foecaufe they did not keep up to
the antient ftandard*

AN eiTential defect runs through
them all. They have taken for
their fpeakers, not real, but^?/-
tiQus characters ; contrary to the
practice of the old writers ; and to
the infinite difadvantage of this
mode of writing, in every refpefto

THE love of truth, they fay,
is fo natural to the human mind
that we expeft to find the appear-
ance of it, even in our arhufe-
ments. In fome indeed, the flen-
dereft fhadow of it will fuffice: in
others, we require to have the fub-
j ftance



PREFACE.

ftance prefented to us. In all cafes,
the degree of probability is to be
eftimated from the nature of the
work. Thus, for inftance, when a
writer undertakes to inftruft or en->
tertain us in the way of Dialogue,
he obliges himfelf to keep up to
the idea, at leaft, of what he pro-
feffes. The converfation may not
have really been fuch as is repre-
fented j but we expeft it to have
all the forms of reality. We bring
with us a difpofition to be deceived
(for we know his purpofe is not to
fecite historically, but to feign pro-
bably) ; but it looks like too great
an infult on our underftandings,
when the writer ftands upon no
ceremony with us, and refufes to
be at the expence of a little art or
management to deceive us.

VOL, I. b HENCE



xviii PREFACE.

.

HENCE the probabilities, or*
what is called the decorum, of this
competition. We afk, " Who the
perfons are, that are going to con-
verfe before us :" " Where and
when the converfation paffed :**
And " by what means the com-
pany came together/ 1 If we are
let into none of thefe particulars^
or, rather if a way be not found to
fatisfy us in all of them, we take
no intereft in what remains ; and
give the fpeakers, who in this cafe
are but a fort of Puppets, no more
credit, than the opinion we chance
to entertain of their Prompter, de-
mands from us,

ON the other hand, when fitch
perfons are brought into the fcene as



PREFACE. xl*

are known to us, and we have been
ufed to refpeft, and but fo much
addrefs employed in {hewing them
as may give us a colourable pre-
tence to fuppofe them really con-
verfing together, the writer himfelf
difappears, and is even among the
firft to fall into his own delufion*
For thus CICERO himfelf repre-
fents the matter z

" THIS way of difcourfe, fays he*
<c which turns on the authority of
" real perfons, and thofe the moft
*' eminent of former times, is, I
* ( know not how, more interefting
" c< than any other : In fo much that
* in reading my own Dialogue on
** old age I am fometimes ready
** to conclude, in good earneft, it

b ?



xx PREFACE.

" is not I, but CATO himfelf, who
" is there fpeaking [6]."

So complete a deception, as this,
requires the hand of amafter. But
fuch CICERO was; and had it been
his defign to make the higheft en-
comium of his own Dialogues, he
could not, perhaps, have done it fo
well by any other circumftance.

BUT now this advantage is whol-
ly loft by the introduction of ficti-
tious perfons. Thefe may do in
Comedy, nay, they do the beft there,
where character only, or chiefly, is



Genus hoc fermonum, pofitum in ho-
minum veterum au&oritate, et eorum illuf-
trium, plus nefcio quo pa6k> videtur haberc
gravitatis. Itaque ipfe mea legens, fie afRcior
interdum, ut Catonem, non me loqui ex-
iftimem. Cic. De Amic. c. i.

defigned,



PREFACE. xxi

defigned. In Dialogue, we muft
have real perfons, and thofe only :
for character here is but a fecondary
confideration ; and there is no other
way of giving weight and authority
to the converfation of the piece.

AND here, again, CICERO may
inftrucfl us ; who was fo fcrupulous
on this head that he would not put
his difcourfe on old age into the
mouth of TITHONUS, although a
Greek writer of name had fet him
the example, becaufe, as he obferves,
a fabulous p erf on 'would have bad no
great authority [c]. What then
would he have faid of merely fan-
cied and ideal perfons, who have

[c] Omnem fermonem tribuimus non Ti-
thono, ut Arifto Chius ; parum enlm effet
h In f alula. De Senet. c i,

b 3 not



PREFACE,

not fo much as that fhadowy ex-*
iftence in the plauiibility of a cur*
rent tale, to recommend them ?

WHEN I fay that char after is but
& fecondary conji deration in Dia^
logue, the reader fees I confine my-
felf to that fpecies only, which was
in ufe among the antients, properly
fo called; and of which PLATO
and CICERO have left us the beft
models.

IT is true, in later times, a great
wit took upon him to extend the
province of Dialogue, and, like an-
other PROMETHEUS [d}> (as, by an
equivocal fort of compliment, it
feems, was obferved of him) created

See the Dialogue entitled, Ufa TOV



yw.

a new



PREFACE. xxiii

a new fpecies ; the merit of which
confifts in aflbciating two things,
not naturally allied together, The
feverity of pbilofophic Dialogue, with
the humour of the Comic.

BUT as unnatural as the alliance
may feem, this fort of competition
has had its admirers. In particular,
ERASMUS was fo taken with Lu-
ci AN'S Dialogue, that he has tranf-
fufed its higheft graces into his
own ; and employed thofe fine
arms to better purpofe againft the
Monks, than the forger of them
had done, againft the Philofophers.

IT muft further be confeffed, that
this innovation of the Greek writer
had fome countenance from the
genius of the old Socratic Dialogue;

b 4 fuch



xxlv PREFACE.

fuch I mean as it was in the hands
of SOCRATES himfelf [e] $ who
took his name of IRONIST from
the continued humour and ridicule,
which runs through his moral dif-
courfes. But, beiides that the
Athenian's modeft IRONY was of
another tafte, and better fuited to
the decorum of converfation, than
the Syrian's frontlefs buffoonery,
there was this further difference in
the two cafes. SOCRATES em-
ployed this method of ridicule, as
the only one by which he could
hope to difcredit thofe mortal foes
of reafon, the SOPHISTS ; Lu-?
CIAN, in mere wantonnefs, to in*
fult its beft friends, the PHILOSO-
PHERS, and even the parent of Phi-



^ [*] *E7rcuiv Spa (jrxdoi^w' Xen. Mem.
1. i. c, 3.



PREFACE, xxv

lofophy, himfelf. The Sage would
have dropped his IRONY, in the
company of the good and wife :
The Rhetorician, is never more
pleafed than in confounding both,
by his intemperate SATIRE.

HOWEVER, there was likenefs
enough in the features of each man-
ner y to favour Luci AN'S attempt in
compounding his new Dialogue. He
was not difpleafed, one may fup-
pofe, to turn the comic art of SO-
CRATES againft himfelf j though
he could not but know that the
ableft mafters of the Socratic fchool
employed it fparingly ; and that,
when the noble Roman came to
philofophize in the way of Dia-
logue, he difdained to make any ufe

it, at all,

IN



PREFACE,



IN a word, as it was taken up,
ferve a turn, fo it was very properly
laid afide, with the occafion. And
even while the occafion lafted, this
humorous manner was far enough,
as I obferved, from being pufhed to
a Scenic licence ; the great artifts
in this way knowing very well,
that, when SOCRATES brought
Philofophy from Heaven to Earth,
It was not his purpofe to expofe
her on the ftage, but to introduce
her into good company.

AND here, to note it by the way,
what has been obferved of the
Ironic manner of the Socratic Dia-
logue, is equally true of its Jubtle
queftlonlng dialectic genius. This,
too 5 had its rife from the circum-

ftance



PREFACE. xxvii

fiances of the time, and the views
of its author, who employed it
with much propriety and even
elegance to entrap, in their own
cob-web nets, the minute, quib-
bling, captious fophifts, How it
chanced that this part of its cha-
rafter did not, alfo, ceafe with its
ufe, but was continued by the fuc-
ceffors in that fchool, and even car-
ried fo far as to provoke the ridi-
cule of the wits, till, at length, it
brought on the juft difgrace of the
Socratic Dialogue itfelf, all this is
the proper fubjedl of another in-
quiry,

OUR concern, at prefent, is with
LUCIAN'S Dialogue; whether he
were indeed the inventor of this



PREFACE,

fpecies, or, after SOCRATES, only
the efpoufer of it.

THE account, given above, that
It unites and incorporates the federal
virtues of the Comic and Philofb-

V c/

fbic manner, is in LUCIAN'S own
words [f]. Yet his Dialogue does
not, as indeed it could not, cor-
refpond exadtly to this idea. CI-
CERO thought it no eafy matter
to unite Philofophy* 'with Polite*
nefs [g] : What then would he have
faid of incorporating Philofophy^
'with Comic Ridicule?

To do himjuftice, LUCIAN him-
felf appears fenfible enough of the






pM17. C. 7.

[g] Difficillimam illam focietatem Gram-
tails cum Humanitatt* Leg, 1, iii. c. i.

difficulty.



PREFACE. xxix

difficulty. I have prefumed, fays
he, to conneff and put together two
things, not very obfequious to my de~
ign^ nor difpofed by any natural fym-
pathy to bear the foclety of each
other [/6]. And therefore we find
him on all occafions more folli-
citous for the fuccefs of this hazard-
ous enterprize, than for the credit
of his invention. Every body was
ready to acknowledge the novelty
of the thing ; but he had forne rea-
fon to doubt with himfelf, whe-
ther it were gazed at as a monfter,
or admired as a juft and reafonable
form of . compofition. So that not












c. 7.

.being



^PREFACE.

being able to refolve this fcruple*
to his fatisfadtion, he extricates
himfelf, as ufual, from the per-
plexity, by the force of his comic
humour i and concludes at length*
That be had nothing left for it but to
perfevere in the choice he had once
made > that is, to preferve the cre-
dit of his own confiftency at leaft,
if he could not prevail to have his
Dialogue accepted by the judicious
reader, under the idea [/] of a con*
fiftent compofttion*

THE ingenious writer had, fure-
ly, no better way to take, in his
diftrefs. For the two excellencies,
he meant to incorporate in his Dia-
logue, cannot, in a fuprerne degree



[/] ITfo^yiO. c. 7, to the end,
c e 33. and Zfv^if.

of



PREFACE. xxxi

of each, fubfift together. The one
muft be facrificed to the other.
Either the philofophic part muft
give place to the dramatic, or the
dramatic muft withdraw, or reftrain
itfelf at leaft, to give room for a juft
difplay of the philofophic*

AND this, in fadt, as I obferved,
is the cafe in LUCIAN'S own Dia-
logues. They are highly dramatic,
in which part his force lay ; while
his Philofophy ferves only to edge
his wit, or fimply to introduce it.
They have, ufually, for their fub-
jeft, not, a QUESTION DEBATED j

but, a TENET RIDICULED, Of, a
CHARACTER EXPOSED. In this

view, they are doubtlefs inirni table :
I mean when he kept himfelf, as

too frequently he did not, to fuch

tenets



xxxii PREFACE,

tenets or characters, as deferve to t
treated in this free manner*

BUT after all, the other fpecies,
theferioiis, pbilofopbic Dialogue, is
the nobleft and the beft. It is the
noble/I, in all views ; for the dig-
nity of its fubjecTr, the gravity of its
manner, and the importance of its
end. It is the bejt, too ; I mean,
it excels moft in the very truth
and art of compofition ; as it go-
verns itfelf entirely by the rules of
decorum, and gives a juft and faith-
ful image of what it would repre-
fent : whereas the comic Dialogue,
diftorting, or, at leaft, aggravating
the features of its original, pleafes
at fome expence of probability;
and at length attains its end but in
part, for want of dramatic aStfott*

the



PREFACE. xxxiii

the only medium, through which
humour can be perfectly con-



THUS, the ferious Dialogue is
abfolute in itfelf ; arid fully obtains
its purpofe : the humorous or cha-
rafteriftic, but partially ; and is, at
beft, the faint copy of a higher
fpecies, the Comic Drama.

Ho WEvfcR, the authority of Lu-
CIAN is fo great, and the manner
itfelf fo taking, that for thefe rea-
lons, but chiefly for the fake of
variety, the FIRST of the follow-
ing Dialogues (and in part too,
the SECOND) pretends to be of
this clafs.

VOL, I % c BUT



xxxhr PREFACE.



BUT to return to our proper fub-

jedl, THE SERIOUS OR PHILOSO-
PHIC DIALOGUE.

i. I OBSERVED (and the reafon
now appears) that character is a
fubordinate confideration, in this
Pialogue. The manners are to be
given indeed, but fparingly, and, as
it were, by accident. And this
grace (which fo much embellifhes
3, well compofed work) can only be
had by employing REAL, KNOWN,
and RESPECTED fpeakers. Each of
thefe circumftances, in the choice
of a fpeaker, is important. The
jirft, excites our curioiity : the fe-
condy affords an eafy opportunity of
painting the manners by thofe
flight and carelefs ftrokes, which

alone



PREFACE. XXXT

alone can be employed for this
purpofe, and which would not
fufficiently mark the characters
of unknown or fidlitious perfons :
And the laft, gives weight and dig-
nity to the whole compofition.

BY this means, the dialogue
becomes, in a high degree, natural
and, on that account, affedting : a
thoufand fine and delicate allulions
to the principles, fentiments, and
hiftory of the Dialogifls keep their
characters perpetually in view :
we have a rule before us, by which
to eftimate the pertinence and pro-
priety of what is faid : and we